Regardless of whether Apple bows down to pressure on this, it shows you how they think. It’s their phone, not yours. Tim Apple is your daddy and as long as you live under his roof, you live under his rules. And he’s just made it clear he can enter your room whenever he likes and search your drawers. Might be time to think about moving out.

Problem is, where do you go? Do you move in with creepy uncle Google next door? No, he’s even worse.

And your banking app only works on iOS and Android…

…I’m seeing people say “just don’t use an iPhone.” It’s not that simple when everyday things like financial apps with two-factor authentication are locked into the two main platforms.

We need legislation to ensure critical services use open standards so you can use your Pinephone to buy lunch in the future.

It’s shocking how easily some folks jump to “just go live in a cave.” No, that’s not an acceptable alternative. We deserve to partake in modern life without sacrificing our human rights…

@aral I don't live in a cave and I don't even have a smartphone. I don't consider tapping a phone screen to be a human right, though. I have tons of other ways to pay for lunch, none of which require a pocket computer.

These (questionably) critical services are created and driven by corporate interests and I don't see a path toward making them do anything altruistic with them.


@khm “I have tons of other ways to pay for lunch, none of which require a pocket computer.”

But you may not, in the future.

It’s already starting to happen in places like the Netherlands and Sweden.

And once cash is phased out in certain jurisdictions and once not having a phone is seen as a cause for suspicion, it will be much harder to make such statements. And then you might have to go live in a cave.

It might not hurt us to look down the road a bit as we slam down on the gas petal.

@aral @khm anecdotal evidence: I was on a trip through Sweden and wanted to buy a local SIM card with cash. I tried three different shops and all three refused cash categorically, credit card or a bunch of different phone apps only. As much as I like “the nordics” culturally, that was eye-openingly disgusting.

Required by law sadly :/
But there is no roaming fees inside EU anymore since 2018, which is nice.


"Vad händer vid strömavbrott eller kris om allt är digitalt?"

Vill påstå att ingen kommer kunna betala kontant om strömmen går ändå.
Problemet är att det är dyrt och krångligt att hantera kontanter. Det bör finnas sätt som gör det billigare för butiker att hantera kontanter - ser inte ut som att kontaktupproret adresserar det alls.

@selea Would’ve been nice for them to say so. Not that it would have been less bad philosophically, but they didn’t even seem to comprehend that someone might want to use cash… Felt like a Twilight Zone episode.

Might just be Sweden.
Never happened to me in Denmark.
In fact, my local Syrian grocer doesn't accept anything but cash (for completely legal reasons, I'm sure).
@aral @khm

@aral @khm

Not having android or iPhone is suspicious too lol.

Atleast there is some organisations in Sweden that it working for a eID solution that works with Linux

@selea @aral @khm the eID in Germany (AusweisApp2) is open source and while not officially maintained you can download it via fdroid. It's also cross platform so same here, its availible for Linux but not supported. The corona warn app is also open source so that a inofficial fork #cctg is on fdroid. Unfortunately nothing for mobile Linux. On the other hand there are also services like the eGK (patient data app) which require Google or Apple…

@dukethereal @selea @aral everybody likes to shit-talk America for not jumping on cutting-edge national identity-management bandwagons, but nobody stops to think about the second- and third-order effects these technologies invariably have.

The topic at hand (invariably the corporations with the most lobbying money provide the keystone tech) is just the start. Accessibility issues and economic inequalities follow. Finally the deliberate exclusion policies show up. Govt-mandated tech SUCKS.

@khm @selea @aral I understand your concern. However leaving the field for big tech to play is a worse alternative. Imagine having to use Google or Apple ID when creating a bank account, buying a car or your medicine treatment…
That sounds like a dystopia to me.
So for me the most important thing is that Government follows #publicmoneypubliccode - about what should be digitalized in the first place is ofc another discussion 😄

@aral @khm I had to buy a new phone recently because my bank's app doesn't even support older versions of Android, never mind alternatives to iOS/Android, and they now require their app for 2FA on online purchases.

Lunch I can still get without a phone, for now.

@aral @khm
And? Do you think it is acceptable to build a society based on that?

May be the right answer is to refuse it just to prevent that a lot of people have to go live in a cave.

Or, may be to accept it is to contribute that a lot of people have to go live in a cave.

@aral @khm In 2020, there was a California court case where Apple itself tried to argue that iPhones (and smartphones in general) were not essential to everyday life. The California Supreme Court practically laughed them out of the courtoom.

Sign in to participate in the conversation
Aral’s Mastodon

The social network of the future: No ads, no corporate surveillance, ethical design, and decentralization! Own your data with Mastodon!