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@aral Yeah its actually a big problem that NEEDS to be addressed

@aral …Fun fact, customers can bypass compliance for things that they really want to buy. They have to fill out a form that says "we looked at alternatives that were compliant and they sucked, and $vendor solemnly swears they’re aware of this and will fix it real soon now.” This has to be refiled with every renewal until the product meets standards, so it’s painful for everyone and a good barrier to remove, but not impermeable… http://monkeynoodle.org/2023/09/16/pick-your-poison/

@aral One of the missions financed by the Sovereign Tech Fund is precisely "Design and prototype a new accessibility stack". It's discussed almost every week in This Week in GNOME, for example https://thisweek.gnome.org/posts/2024/02/twig-135/.

@aral wow that's shitty

@aral@mastodon.ar.al Does it still work on X11? Many of the distros have had Wayland as only a secondary option and recently started making it the default, clearly this should not have been allowed to happen.

@aral I use linux as a daily driver, and while it might have some accessibility issues here and there, I wouldn't call it entirely inaccessible. Sure, orca keystrokes are also passing through the system, but without some egregious keyboard hooks, that's how it is at the moment. The keys do work though, and I'm speaking from experience, because I'm running kde sometimes, the wayland session. There are genuine problems with linux accessibility, but this one isn't it, and only because it's technically impossible with wayland, it doesn't mean that it's not currently working in some way, due to xwayland. Also, the author of the issue is working on a portal and wayland protocol to make this work in such a way that the system doesn't get the jesture before the screenreader does, and it'll first come to mutter, the gnome compositor, so there's a lot of hope. That issue is grossly simplifying and miswording the graveness of the problem a bit, and it paints linux in a worse light than it deserves. I personally worked with some people in this sphere to make their apps accessible, I was there when a lot of the protocols around wayland and accessibility technologies was discussed in the gnome accessibility room a relatively short amount of time ago, so were others, and many of us are doing the best we can. That comment explains some things right, but by saying that accessibility on wayland is currently broken, more or less invalidates my and others hard work on the matter, because stuff isn't totally broken in wayland. I know people who use sway, I know people who use plasma, same for myself, and it seemns like either only gnome/mutter has this problem, or something really bad happened over night, when I wasn't looking. Keygrabbing in the x11 form is, yes, not possible, but the thing we currently have works well, though of course a pure wayland solution would be much better. Please don't fully believe what you read on face value, however well intended that comment was, I really recommend you try it for yourself, though I do agree that if I were to pick between gnome and kde for accessibility, I'd pick kde, simply because those people seemn to care more about this stuff, at least for now. So, to clarify, did this start recently? I got gdm issues recently too, where orca just wouldn't start speaking at the first login screen after turning on the computer, but it would work afterwards. I dk, I think this total inability of passing keystrokes to orca is unique to mutter, because in other environments, and mutter before some version I didn't use apparently, did pass the keys to orca, but same for the actual system, so kapslock would be toggled while the orca key combo would still work, but work it did though.

@aral Last I checked (which, admittedly, was at least a few months ago) you can't change keyboard layouts on Fedora due to Wayland as well...which is why all my systems are still running X for the foreseeable future...I did ask about it on the Fedora forums when I first hit that issue and was advised to remove Wayland...

@aral@mastodon.ar.al i was trying to figure this out the other day, as i recently started using a screen reader on my phone after a minor eye injury, and decided to keep using it since i found having an eyes-free interaction method very convenient

i wanted to set up something similar on my Linux systems, but i have had a horrible time trying to get something working, and basically gave up

i would be perfectly happy to only have this work within a single terminal window, and i can't even get that working enough to be useful. i wouldn't blame a blind user for not bothering - if that were me, i'd probably be running straight for apple

it is beyond disappointing