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Aral Balkan

Joe Biden could still turn this around and not lose to Trump by defunding Israel’s genocide of the Palestinian people. If he doesn’t, there will be only person to blame for Joe Biden losing to Trump in six months and that’s Joe “I am a Zionist” Biden.

#USPol#JoeBiden#GenocideJoe
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Taran Rampersad

@aral I don't know that he's a Zionist, but here's what I do know.

(1) Palestinians don't have a fiscal lobby of note, whereas Israelis do.

(2) Campaign donations are considered 'free speech'. 👀

(3) No one seems have demanded that Democrats 'divest'. In fact, quite the opposite, they'll crawl out of the woodwork and tell you, "If Trump wins..."

If the campaign is about fear, we're seeing Hillary all over again. Fleetingly.

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Alexandre Oliva
if we're to believe wikipedia and a friend of mine who is familiar with the matter, being zionist means just supporting the existence of the state of Israel, and the self-determination of the jewish people. nevermind that supporting a racist and non-laïc state isn't such a great idea IMHO, but it doesn't follow (and here's the key point I'm trying to make) being or claiming to be zionist doesn't make one a supporter of genocide, or of jewish supremacy. that's an undercurrent of zionism, and assigning it to all zionists is probably a mistake. I don't know where biden stands there, it may very well be that he is among the proponents of jewish supremacy, but I see injustice in your statement in the implication that being zionist is in itself a horribly reproachable thing.
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Alexandre Oliva
@aral FWIW, a Brazilian cartoonist (in Portuguese, Zionism is spelled as Sionismo) published a cartoon in which one of the highlights was the initials of Zionist Supremacy: SS
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Aral Balkan

@lxo If only we had some way of knowing… a hint or something… like if he was selling arms and funding a genocide in Palestine.

But yes, sure, it’s my statement in all of this that reeks of injustice.

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Alexandre Oliva
we're miscommunicating. I'm not disagreeing with the criticism to biden. I'm disagreeing that that same criticism applies to everyone who supports jewish people's self-determination and statehood. AFAICT most jewish people oppose the genocide of their fellow semites, even though most jewish people are zionists. they just aren't affiliated with the jewish supremacy movement that is within zionists.
analogously, if Biden claimed "I'm human", and you criticized all humans because some humans have sided with genocide, I'd be nearly compelled (by my spot in the ND spectrum) to point out that your statement is an overgeneralization, even though your criticism to that particular subset of humans is well-founded. is that clear?
the problem is that we lack a term to refer to the specific subset of zionists that supports palestinian genocide. that's probably by design, because it's harder to criticize that which one can't even name.
I suggest referring to them as jewish supremacists, or perhaps zionist zupremacists :-)
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Alexandre Oliva
there are other relevant elements here. even if a graver injustice is taking place, your statement carries an implied lesser injustice, and one doesn't excuse the other. it may be the case that biden doesn't care about such injustice, but I know that you care about injustice, and probably so do most zionists, and they are fighting the graver injustice like we are, from an advantage point that many of them can even vote to replace the lead promoter of the genocide, so I'd prefer if you weren't alienate them (or yourself) by lashing at them with too wide a net. aiming criticism at those who deserve it will help strengthen our opposition to the massacre, instead of dividing it by internal fights such as what this overbroad criticism might bring about. thanks for listening,
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